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It looks like an agreement has been reached and Wagner are stepping down their invasion and returning to base.

Kwacky wrote: ↑24 Jun 2023, 18:56 It looks like an agreement has been reached and Wagner are stepping down their invasion and returning to base.

Maybe Biden should have allowed the CIA a bigger budget then..

I can't see how both sides walk away and forget about this.

I think Prigozhin permanently lost support from some war supporters because of this. Putin publicly declared these actions a betrayal, and it appears Wagner shot down several Ru Air Force aircraft, which they need. He also publicly embarrassed Putin and made him look weak.

Putin likes his revenge

I've been following the Ukraine counter-offensive. It doesn't appear to be going well at the moment. The Russians have had months to prepare for it. They're dug in, behind lines of mines, they've got artillery covering all routes, helicopters with 10km anti tank missiles, trenches, drones, dragons teeth AWACS and satellites.

Ukraine has been given a lot of Western armour but the crews are inexperienced and they're still using Warsaw Bloc tactics.

They've gained very little ground so far.

I suspect Ukraine will have little choice bit to keep pressing on and hope for a breakthrough somewhere.

Kwacky wrote: ↑24 Jun 2023, 19:56 Putin likes his revenge

Doesn't he just.

StMarks wrote: ↑23 Aug 2023, 22:24

Kwacky wrote: ↑24 Jun 2023, 19:56 Putin likes his revenge

Doesn't he just.

If Prigozhin was on the plane. I don't think it's been confirmed.

Kwacky wrote: ↑24 Aug 2023, 16:44
If Prigozhin was on the plane. I don't think it's been confirmed.

Even if it does get "confirmed" that he was one of those on the plane who died, it may be difficult to know how accurate that confirmation is.?

Fwiw if I had been Prigozhin , I would want an out that avoided having to spend the rest of my life wondering if I would wake up one day duct taped to a chair,,,
I would wait just the right length of time & then make myself a golden opportunity target (whilst surreptitiously sneaking off to start life with a new identity) leaving a plausible body double to do the dying bit along with my mates..

He's got enough contacts to disappear.

He's certainly got the money to make it happen.

Kwacky wrote: ↑24 Aug 2023, 19:28 He's got enough contacts to disappear.

He's certainly got the money to make it happen.

We can never really know, can we.?

What is safe to assume though, despite all the contacts and money, if he did pull off such a stunt & the world believed him to be dead & buried...
If he did,,,

,,,,he would still spend the rest of his life waiting for that day when his past eventually found him.!

The Ukraine counter has been going on for a few months with almost nothing to show for it. Russia had plenty of time to prepare their defences and it paid off. Russia has been carrying out its own attacks in the east and recently gained some ground.

The frosts are starting. Winter isn't far away. It looks like a stalemate. Winter will allow both sides to dig in deeper. Russia will likely use the time to train new recruits and replenish lost equipment. Ukraine doesn't have that luxury, it relies on NATO support and gifts. The west is currently distracted by Israel.

I think Ukraine lost the chance to get it's land back and we're looking at a long term land dispute with both sides manning trenches.

I think you might be right