Grammar schools

[Kwacky]

Itchy's post reminded me of what I went through and my daughter sitting her exams for it.

My daughter buckled. That's no shame on her. She couldn't cope with the pressure and left her second exam.

In a way I'm glad as she's doing very well at her current school, she seems to be relaxed.

Having been a pupil at the Birmingham grammar schools and knowing people whose kids have gone there's a lot of pressure for them to perform once they're there. Most kids in those thrive on it and do very well. In Brum it's all geared up for high level exam results and the next level of education.

What got to me was the level of prep the parents had put their kids through. When I did the 11+ you turned up and did the exam. Some kids now are being trained from as young as 6 how to pass the exam. Surely the point of grammar schools is to help the naturally intelligent to get a better level of education to help them get off to a good start in life?

The proposal to make more schools into grammar schools seems to get rid of the reason for having them IMO.

[Cav]

I went to a grammar school and think they're a good thing. I was from an under-privileged background and it helped me make connections with middle-class families etc. In the world we live in that's worth more than education alone.

I did the practice papers and sat the test - none of this training since 6 malark, I only decided I wanted to go to the grammar school around a year before I went there.

They're brilliant as I don't do well with distractions (hence why I'm on here while at work) and generally everyone is more attentive and teachers are better. That said, the pranks we played on each other were much more clever and witty than the like of the things that happened at our local comps.

[Jack]

I passed the exam but chose to go to the local comp - big mistake on my part , I was about 2 years in front of most people I got bored and got a full time job at 14 in the local butchers

[D41]

A good childhood friend went to one...he needed it I guess, as he's now a rocket scientist. If he had've stayed & gone to a comp. he'd have ended up as a plumber or something daft.

What I never got from my education, was at the age of 12-13 or so they expected you to know what you wanted to do for a career for the rest of your life. I never got that. I already knew for years I was into music and other artsy-fartsy stuff.....AND....working in a trade...I always wanted to do skilled manual labour that didn't require too much thought. Leaves me enough time to daydream while I'm at work, which I excel at.

[duke63]

Maybe if so many state schools offer inadequate education for the majority then the government ought to be looking at why that is rather than just making it better for the more gifted.

Equally if there are no decent well paid jobs for these youngsters at the end then surely the money is spent in the wrong place?

Funny how £50 million can be produced from nowhere to make a political point yet the schools generally have no spare cash.

[Itchy]

Itchy's post reminded me of what I went through and my daughter sitting her exams for it.

My daughter buckled. That's no shame on her. She couldn't cope with the pressure and left her second exam.

In a way I'm glad as she's doing very well at her current school, she seems to be relaxed.

Having been a pupil at the Birmingham grammar schools and knowing people whose kids have gone there's a lot of pressure for them to perform once they're there. Most kids in those thrive on it and do very well. In Brum it's all geared up for high level exam results and the next level of education.

What got to me was the level of prep the parents had put their kids through. When I did the 11+ you turned up and did the exam. Some kids now are being trained from as young as 6 how to pass the exam. Surely the point of grammar schools is to help the naturally intelligent to get a better level of education to help them get off to a good start in life?

The proposal to make more schools into grammar schools seems to get rid of the reason for having them IMO.

We spoke to a few of the other parents whose kids are taking the test.
Some of them have had a tutor for the last couple of years, and are still struggling, which as you say defies the while point of it.

The reason we decided to do the mock tests and other revision aids (which we only started halfway through the summer holidays) was merely to get her used to test conditions that she's never otherwise been exposed to. She is very intelligent and does thrive under pressure but doesn't like tests. When you're looking at the top 10% getting through we just wanted to ensure she gets the best chance she can to show what she can do.

By all accounts the school they took it at was crazy today, around 1300 girls were taking the tests, plus their parents dropping them off, picking them up and causing havoc in the streets!

[Kwacky]

Getting them used to exams before they sit the main one is the right way to do it. But training them from a young age is just wrong IMO.

[D41]

Maybe if so many state schools offer inadequate education for the majority then the government ought to be looking at why that is rather than just making it better for the more gifted.

Equally if there are no decent well paid jobs for these youngsters at the end then surely the money is spent in the wrong place?

Funny how £50 million can be produced from nowhere to make a political point yet the schools generally have no spare cash.

Decent well paid jobs only go to those capable of doing them...and that does not necessarily mean relying on academic qualifications rather than 'savvy'...that's something that can't be taught.
Despite it's failings, the British education system is still a pretty good one, but can accomplish little without the involvement of the parent(s)....which is sadly lacking in all too many instances....too many parents simply regard it as a state-sponsored child daycare system.

[duke63]

The points about parents taking an interest and helping their kids us a good one, D41 but many top companies are expecting even decently qualified and very intelligent youngsters to work for low wages and are abusing the employment laws anyway they can. It's hardly likely to help the young generations think of their employees in a good way. One of Germany's biggest strengths is that employers, employees and unions work together rather than try and squeeze every last penny out of each other.

[D41]

But hasn't that always been the case?? You serve your time for crap wages, and show that you can actually do the job required/stick it out, etc....and then they start bumping you up the pay scale.

I think too many kids leave the school system expecting someone to run up to them with a big hug and a "Hey....you're fecking cool as all hell....here's $50K!!"
The end of schooling is the just the beginning of adulthood, and the end of something that every single kid has to do...it's not something to be immediately rewarded for finishing, as you had no choice in the matter.

[duke63]

There is a difference between learning your craft and starting from the bottom up and having the piss taken to extract more profit for the owners.

Being told you salary is for a 40 hour week but you will have to work additional hours for no pay is abusing employment laws.

[D41]

That's a fair comment....I've never worked a traditional 40-hour week, 'cept for some crap Granada Services job on the M1.
I've always either been salaried, or done 'piece work'....both of which work in my favour........my old boss was a b@stard to work WITH....but great to work FOR, if that makes sense.