Couple of comments about the current road conditions so thought I would start a thread on winter driving as I was blown away by what I saw in finland recently.
Roads are basically covered in slippy compacted snow (not ice) which is slippy enough to do some really good sledging on yet the vehicles have no special equipment other than winter tyres. I m not talking snow chains or studded tyres but just regular road tyres that have a rubber compound suitable for colder temperatures.
And boy are they cold temperatures hottest I saw it was -4 degC and the coldest was -27 degC
A couple of shots show you what I mean.
Last edited by Blade on 19 Dec 2015, 11:27, edited 1 time in total.
Driving standards were so much higher than the UK.
The coaches we went on were regularly doing 60 mph and going round bends at 50mph perfectly safely. I occasionally felt the slightest intervention of the tc but only because I was looking for it, I don't think other passengers were even aware of its activation.
You can see why the Scandinavian nations produce such amazing rally car drivers there ability to drive extremely controlled on low adhesion surfaces is just a basic daily skill.
I think you're under selling winter tyres a bit there lol.
"There are two main differences between winter and normal tyres. Winter tyres have a different tread pattern of wider grooves and narrow slits at the edges of the tread area, which combine to give better grip on snow and ice. The second difference is the material the tyre is made of. The rubber used for the tread section on standard tyres gets stiffer as the temperature drops, and grip starts to reduce below seven degrees Celsius. Winter tyres use a different material which stays soft and grippy to well below zero. Tyres made with this rubber will carry either a snowflake or a mountain as a symbol on the sidewall."
Didn't mean to under rate the winter tyres tbh. I actually put them on our car during winter as it's rear wheel drive and a big handful in low adhesion conditions.
What blew me away was being in conditions where you could see them working properly and how effective they are.
Sat on a 20 ton coach reversing up a steep incline from a stand still in compacted slippy snow showed how much grip these winter tyres can find.
As a user of winter tyres seeing first hand what their capable of has given me alot of confidence in their ability.
DaytonAndy wrote:I think you're under selling winter tyres a bit there lol.
"There are two main differences between winter and normal tyres. Winter tyres have a different tread pattern of wider grooves and narrow slits at the edges of the tread area, which combine to give better grip on snow and ice. The second difference is the material the tyre is made of. The rubber used for the tread section on standard tyres gets stiffer as the temperature drops, and grip starts to reduce below seven degrees Celsius. Winter tyres use a different material which stays soft and grippy to well below zero. Tyres made with this rubber will carry either a snowflake or a mountain as a symbol on the sidewall."
I wonder.; Do modern winter tyres make snow chains obsolete then.?
When I was a child my dad used to fit snow chains to his car in the snow, to great effect. These days I almost never see them.
DaytonAndy wrote:I think you're under selling winter tyres a bit there lol.
"There are two main differences between winter and normal tyres. Winter tyres have a different tread pattern of wider grooves and narrow slits at the edges of the tread area, which combine to give better grip on snow and ice. The second difference is the material the tyre is made of. The rubber used for the tread section on standard tyres gets stiffer as the temperature drops, and grip starts to reduce below seven degrees Celsius. Winter tyres use a different material which stays soft and grippy to well below zero. Tyres made with this rubber will carry either a snowflake or a mountain as a symbol on the sidewall."
I wonder.; Do modern winter tyres make snow chains obsolete then.?
When I was a child my dad used to fit snow chains to his car in the snow, to great effect. These days I almost never see them.
You see them a lot in the mountains. Some passes in the french Alps it's illegal to attempt them without when it's snowed. Most passes have lanes for people to pull into to put them on too.
Winter tyres are worth it on cars though. Some countries make it mandatory to have them on t certain times of year too.
Completely agree with the above comments, very poor standard of driving in this country, but we don't require winter tyres and there's very little pride in the standard of driving from some people, quite the reverse actually.
However, my German friends tell me that regardless of the weather or season, the Insurance companies always try to say you've got the wrong tyres for the conditions to wriggle out of a claim. Some things never change regardless of nationality or mindset.
Never really seen winter tyres do their job. Think that's superb seeing the pics Blade. Would love to try winter tyres when the conditions dictate and think it should be mandatory during winter months as we do see a lot of snow in areas and regularly see minus conditions. When I used to walk to work everyday I regularly saw rear wheel drive cars loose control down a straight road. Even saw them not being able to stop in time and snahing straight into a roundabout!! Think you would be a fool not to get the right tyre if you own a RWD car in my opinion. Not saying FWD cars don't do the same it's just I've seen too many Beemers loose it in even the simplest of roads!
I was running a few errands yesterday, & dashing to the bank in my little Vito I passed a silver Mazda MX5 parked,,,,, on the grass in the middle of the roundabout.!
I took a double take, & realised that the driver was in it.
I was in too much of a hurry to stop & assist, but did wonder how he had managed it.
Anyway, I went back the same way some time later.
He was gone
But as I went round the roundabout (at sensible speed) the Mercedes ESP kicked in.!
Snow & ice may be challenging, but traditional spilt diesel still takes the podium IMHO. That's a knee-down roundabout FFS, if it was summer it wouldn't just be inconveniencing a few cages.
It's a mercedes... the ESP can kick in when you're stationary!! I just turn it off in the merc I drive (although I did get a drift on leaving a roundabout by a petrol station once)
The ABS kicks in REALLY early too which is horrible, it takes all force away from the brake pedal which leaves me a bit panicky - I won't be buying one for myself.
The driving standard is VERY poor though IMO and it only seems to be getting worse
Cav wrote:It's a mercedes... the ESP can kick in when you're stationary!! I just turn it off in the merc I drive (although I did get a drift on leaving a roundabout by a petrol station once)
Really?? My ESP kicks in a bit late, usually when you are half way across the road it decides to cut the power..
You never really learn to swear until you learn to drive.
If everything seems under control, you're not going fast enough - Mario Andretti
