New Street Triple coming - 10th January

[D41]

These new bikes are all tested on the track under ideal conditions....no matter what compromises and/or advances have been made, the stopwatch doesn't lie.

[Cav]

I know this Street Triple is likely to be quicker than the Speed Triple but IMO the Speed is a bit of a lump. I love the looks and the sound but I don't see it as a performance machine; the BHP for the capacity just isn't up to par these days. Compared against the likes of the BMW or the Aprilia it's massively lacking.

It's quite possible that the bike was put deliberately at 121bhp as a marketing strategy because of the Speed Triple - that would make sense. That power is more than the MT09 (probably the current top competitor) but comfortably low enough not to annoy their Speed customers.

[D6]

A 765 triple is broadly equivalent to a 680cc inline 4.

The closest thing would be a 636 ZX6r.

ZX6r is 131 PS and 71 Nm
Street 765 not tuned for red line BHP is 123 PS and 77Nm

I'm not exactly sure what you are getting at. To me it is very compareable to the current 600 supersport bike and is yet a midweight naked.

[Kwacky]

The BMW and the Aprilla are both naked versions of a current sportsbike. The Speed Triple is a stand alone bike. The S3 is 20 bhp down on the BMW but it's got slightly more torque. The triumph is about 11 kg heavier.

The Tuono again has more BHP and about 3 ft/lb more torque but it's a slightly heavier machine

Looking at the figures tells us little, When you look at the graphs though you can see that all 3 of them are producing very similar power up to about 8,000 revs.

The ting is there are a lot of bikes to chose from in the supernaked category. As well as the ones you've mentioned you've got the MT10 and the offering from KTM and Ducati, not to mention the MV Agustas.

It's never ever going to be just about top BHP, otherwise 8 out of the 9 bikes in this group would never sell. They've all got pros and cons for them with different brakes, suspension, weight distribution, power delivery, engine noise, engine configuration......... the list goes on.

[D41]

Yep...very good assessment.
Listen to both these guys, Chav.

[Cav]

Don't take this all the wrong way - I'm certain this bike will be top of the class, I just think they've been a little reserved.

The comparison against the 636 isn't really compelling. The 636 is a 636 to increase mid range torque, the extra 3ps/bhp over the 599cc is pretty fictional from reviews and dyno curves I've seen (btw I don't care much for dyno curves but when tests are back to back it's a pretty fair comparison).

I guess what I'm trying to get at is they've taken a supersport engine, added 100cc and ended up with a figure that isn't particularly overwhelming. I really hoped to see a bike in this class with supersport peak power and impressive midrange torque considering the extra capacity that seems to get thrown at these middleweight class bikes which is inevitably blurring the lines between middle and heavy weight.

[D6]

I really don't understand your point.

I just pointed out it is similar performance to the closest 600 supersport, With only a 6.1% less PS but 8.5 increase in Torque.

Yet is not even tuned for optimum figures like the closest supersport is and only another 36cc off in engine size (comparatively - which you pointed out only added 3ps).

[Kwacky]

Cav, you need to make your mind up. You mention the zx6r, say it's not relevant when D6 mentions it then go on about Triumph using a supersports engine and saying that you want supersports performance in a bike that's not a supersports bike

For the avoidance of doubt, this is not the Daytona 675 replacement. It's the Street Triple replacement.

[D41]

Well then take the Suzi 750 into account also....it doesn't fall into any standard race-derived class...yet it is one of the best sportbikes out there and has enjoyed more longevity than anything else available.

[Kwacky]

https://www.675.cc/675/threads/street-t ... ost-419305" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

There are some photos from the launch night on the 675cc forum

[Blade]

I find it all a little confusing tbh as it jumps around from speed triple to street triple if I'm reading things correctly.

As far as I can make out the speed triple is an iconic bike for triumph and a good seller with unique character.

The street triple gets very good real world reviews from everyone I know who owns one.

Although I understand what D6 is saying personally for me if I was looking for a supersport bike I wouldnt consider a middleweight naked as apart from engine power they are different beast for different roles imo.

Saying that I do see what D6 is getting at regards comparable power output and tbh there that similar i would suggest the actual delivery, flyby wire mapping, response and gearing would influence how things feel more than a couple of bhp on a graph. And let's be honest manufacturers lie on power figures and every dyno is different, so for me there very close on paper but I imagine the delivery could make them feel quite different and rightly so as the 636 and st3 are for different roles Imo.

[D6]

I Although I understand what D6 is saying personally for me if I was looking for a supersport bike I wouldnt consider a middleweight naked as apart from engine power they are different beast for different roles imo. .

I'm not saying it is a supersorts bike. That's my point. Its a midweight naked bike yet kicks out comparable performance to 600supersport bikes.

To me that a real win for a real world naked bike. It'll be designed to perform on road not track, yet is boasting similar figures to a 636.

[Blade]

Sounds good and I'm sure it's a great bike.

If I did want a middleweight naked it would most likely be top of the list.

[Blade]

IMO a middleweight naked should have 130bhp (seeing as middle weight now means "just under 1000cc" in most cases) and a heavyweight naked should have 160bhp.

The ZX6R has 128bhp so a 750 with significant mid-range torque should be able to produce the same peak power.

Engines produce Torque not power.

High torque with low revs will make less power than a lower torque output at much higher revs.

It's just maths at the end of the day as engines only ever produce torque.

[Blade]

Now that sounds a lot of fun.

Test ride getting booked on that don't want to buy one but do fancy having a cheeky blast on it after reading the description.

Great marketing that

[Cav]

It's difficult to concisely say what I mean when there are so many possible tangents..

Supersport - high revving, high peak power. For me the '13+ 636 isn't a supersport because its engine characteristics are much more like a naked middleweight.

The Daytona 675 is a supersport and is what the 2017 Street Triple engine is based on (it shares 80% of parts with the Daytona and only 10% with the Street). The 2017 Street is NOT a supersport - I fully agree with you.

However, to start with a supersport engine that has 128PS, add ~100cc and end up with 121PS (only 300rpm lower than the daytona) just doesn't sit right with me. The torque is only 5Nm more than the Daytona and 1000rpm lower. Obviously the torque and power range has been widened from this - perfect for the road.

Understand that I'm only comparing against the Daytona because that's where the engine has come from...

Comparing it against the '16 Street Triple starts to look better though.

'17 Street:
121PS @ 11,700rpm
77Nm @ 10,800rpm

'16 Street:
105PS @ 11,700rpm
69Nm @ 9,100rpm

I wasn't comparing the Street Triple against the Daytona as a bike - only with regard to the engine (donor)




Blade - bhp = torque x engine speed... I'm on the same page

[D41]

This is like trying to make a tomato out of ketchup.

[Blade]

Blade - bhp = torque x engine speed ÷ 5252. I'm on the same page

You are now

Tbh it's not as black and white as changing capacity. They may have altered cam profile and duration, ignition advance, fuelling etc... Too many unknow variables.

Reality is get on it and ride it. If it makes you smile, laugh and be a little scared it's good un

[TonyB]

This is like trying to make a tomato out of ketchup.

I'm going to use that

[Blade]

I think my lad trys that most tea times